I can't promise the clever. I'll certainly give the contributions.

Oh yes. I won't say that he's lying, just withholding the truth.

The second one is that on the blue book, I thought I heard when evidence was given that it was the police who decided to lock away the book. They may have got it from Mulcaire ...

I think you could say the one who became the master thought he would be the pupil, and the man who became the pupil thought he would be the master, and that was the problem.

I acted as a kind of bed and breakfast from time to time, you know, get another story in the journalism, but I mean, look, these were two brilliant men who had different agreements about certain aspects of policy. Of course they disagree, and I would look at the record ...

Thank you.

I talked to a number of people about that, and I've been thinking, and then this morning you sparked me off to say so long as you get it in before May, we could give some comments too, and I'd like to take that opportunity.

Yes.

It has to work.

Vince Cable. The two people were sent in to take a recording, quite against the Editors' Code, no doubt about it, and then the apology given by the Daily Telegraph put in the paper actually says, "Yes, we knew the Editors' Code didn't allow it", but it had not ...

A proper balance, which you're going to have to address yourself to anyway. I think we will be quite happy -- you see, I hear the arguments going on about the PCC at the moment, press complaints people as if somehow it's about statutory. I don't want to ...

There is influence. It's different from a few constituents getting together or even the doctors' organisation, and a big media operation like Murdoch, who will then say, for example, whether this government is worth supporting or not -- and it happens. You can see it with the Coalition at the ...

In a democracy, it's absolutely essential that interest groups work that way. Take the health bill we've got at the moment. The doctors may be against it, others may be for it. There are debates going on. We have them in Parliament, we'll get it again today ...

I think --

If you take the debate that's occurred over this, about Sky. There was a very vigorous debate, both in the Commons and in the House of Lords, where we made clear that -- what evidence we had that this man wasn't a fit and proper person to have majority ...

No, to be honest, I can't think they gave them an exchange, but they will be hoping that the paper comes for them in the election. That papers actually believe they win the elections, and so I think the politicians get to think it best to have them on ...

No.

No, I can't say it's improper. I think it's an exercise of political power over an interest group which I don't like and argue against and did do at that time.

But I have to -- the one I've given you is before what we are ...

Yeah.

Well, I could give you Coulson on the other one, but I'll leave that, but if it comes to my own government you're talking about, they did ask particularly -- the competition one, I think, was involved with us as well, but we believed that they could have a ...

I went to see it before, and that's it. I hope -- they always tidy up my grammar because I never get it right. Allows the press to have something to write about.

But anyway, if you look at the case of the legal aid bill that we have in ...

No, I can feel the sympathy for the Hansard writer.

I'm sorry, I'm sorry.

Yeah. Well, look at -- let's take Murdoch, because that's the one we're actually considering particularly, though most of them would agree. One was whether Murdoch should buy -- have more than 50 per cent of control of the press. Everybody basically went along with it, because they were ...

Well, Murdoch operated with all governments, but if I can just make this first point: I'm not the best to ask about the relations with the press, because mine's never been good, but I'll give you my opinion.

In regard to Murdoch press, I always thought it ...

Sounds like the News of the World offered a better deal.

But it was really scandalous, that here's the guy in charge of the investigation joins the Murdoch press and then writes constantly attacking you. I haven't heard from him since, but up till then it was.

I don't know if it was the same article in which he attacked me in saying there's no truth in this. Having left the investigation and joined the Murdoch press, writes for the Times and said, "If there's any truth in these accusations that Prescott is making ...

-- saw a connection between it.

I assume that's the assumption they came to. They gave me the same damages as they gave the press(?) so perhaps they even --

Yes. Yes, that was -- yeah. In the News International case.

I joined the group, they were already in the process of doing it, a little later, but yes, it was concluded against the News of the World, or News International. My concern all that time, and why I was late in joining in the action, was I thought the most ...

Yes.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

No, no, but I'm saying I'm a bit surprised at the "no comment" because in the evidence I was reading recently he'd actually said that they'd got the number -- they hadn't got Prescott's number and couldn't get it, and then -- so I think ...

With "no comment"?

I know.

Sorry, paragraph? I missed you.

Yeah.

Yeah, I'm just saying I don't call it a cock up. These are highly paid, highly intelligent people. I think there's more a conspiracy of silence to hide the facts and frankly I'm stronger of that view in the last few months.

You sound more charitable than me.

I think that was the proper way they could have done it. They chose not to, and it's when you don't take these other avenues that you get a bit suspicious about it. It's like when we had to have an extra interview with Yates and the ...

I agree.

Yeah.

It's the four corners that concern me. Everything has to be in the perspective of that time. We all knew there was a blue book with all the names in. That's what the Guardian was really referring to. So we knew there were more than just a few ...

I know it does happen.

-- to comment on. The same answers coming from the police were coming from the public prosecutors. If it's right, I can understand that, but they gave me one answer, which they tried to say, "Look, there's an understanding between us" -- and I think it's been referred to ...

As I go to each body -- and I went to the prosecuting office. They sent a letter to me, and I think it's not Mr Starmer, but one before, Mr Macdonald --

May I just give you one other point which began to influence my mind at this, which it wasn't right?

That was probably what was taken as an interjection by myself, for which I apologise. I thought it was, just mention it, quite common, but it was really about: if you're investigating somebody, do you have a meal? But I think that was answered by Mr Paddick later.