The transcripts of the official inquiry into the culture, practices and ethics of the press. More…

That's very kind of you to allow me to explain.

But what happened on the Human Rights Act, I got the third reading speech in the House of Lords. I said I stand ready to talk to the government if they should think -- and then Jack Straw rang me when he got to the Commons and he said, "I hear you're very unhappy with that", and he was unhappy too, and so we met and we devised -- or he devised section 12, which was an attempt, as I understand it -- what I understood was that section 12 was really to give a newspaper the defence that they had behaved in accordance with the code and therefore that was a proper way to behave and therefore freedom of expression would take the priority. That's what he said.

I didn't comment on whether it was effective or not, partly because both Jack Straw and David Irving are friends of mine and the last thing I wanted to do was get involved in what appeared to be a discussion between the two of them. I just wanted to get the thing as right as I could.

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